ARB Minutes - May 25, 2005

Minutes

Architectural Review Board

Village/Town of Mount kisco

May 25, 2005

Members in Attendance: Frank Tortorello

Nancy Abramson

Steve Marrano

Members Absent:

Meeting called to order 7:30 p.m.

Minutes from April 20, 2005 to be voted on at next meeting

Returning Cases:

Case #05-18

Anthony Montelone counsel for the applicant, Diane Douglas, and Tom Mesuk.

Anthony Montelone: Just to review and I don't want to repeat myself. This is what Sam Goody had and it didn't include the Villarina store which we are now taking over. What I would like to show you is what we are proposing and what we have taken into account. We understand you do not want anything in the tower and we are not going to put anything in the tower. We were thinking about putting in a flag pole but the village did not want us to put one up overhanging the village property. What we are proposing now is signage over the three windows. The Villarina store is actually going to be the ATM. So we do need signage over that. The others are in the niches that were designed by the architect whom I believe it critical of our signage. The sign in the entry is a sign that is not that much different from what Sam Goody had. They previously had a sign there. These signs are white during the day and in the evening they turn dark blue. The flag is the same day and night. The signage here we feel we need some identification there. That is not signage per say that is really pressed on.

Diane Douglas: That is illuminated sign behind the glass.

Anthony Montelone: The red affixed to a piece acrylic and a sign box. It is illuminated 24/7 and stays the same color.

Nancy Abramson: This is part of a sign package this building.

Anthony Montelone: When you say a sign package. I believe your board has the notes and those notes indicated nothing on the tower. We are not doing anything on the tower. It is the memo that was part of the approval for the building.

Steve Marrano: How far are you going down the side?

Anthony Montelone: The same signage as here.

Steve Marrano: The three windows.

Anthony Montelone: If you talk to me about removing that middle one I think I can convince Bank of America to do that.

Steve Marrano: The red one over the door?

Anthony Montelone: No. That memo from the original approval there is nothing on the tower. The design in here calls for signage over the three show windows. There is a niche above each of those six windows. We are honoring the requirement nothing in the tower. We did have signage in the tower and made two different proposals. Now we want to keep everything at grade level.

Steve Marrano: The red sign over the door is not lit?

Diane Douglas: It is lit. Back lighted.

Nancy Abramson: Is this sign package for a certain kind of gold leaf? They all seem to be gold leaf. Every single sign was not lit and it was in the gold leaf lettering. That is the package correct?

(Too many people speaking)

Anthony Montelone: This is not what I am talking about. There is a separate memo that says no signage on the tower. This is just the sign package for Sam Goody.

Frank Tortorello: This is the sign package for the whole building.

That appears to be the signage that was approved at that point in time.

Anthony Montelone: I disagree that the colors and the type of signage.

Nancy Abramson: it seems to me when they approved these sign packages it solved the type of signs that were allowed.

Anthony Montelone: This sign package is consistent with Sam Goody.

Nancy Abramson: All the signs matched.

Frank Tortorello: In fact some of the more recent stores on the street are basically done in the same style.

Anthony Montelone: Well the Victoria Secret sign is different.

Frank Tortorello: Not this, they are not sign boxes. They are individual letters. This is what we have been trying to get that point across.

Anthony Montelone: I agree with you that there is nothing shown on the tower. Above the windows as shown on the plan and this is before the board for review. The signage placement would be written into the lease. I don't see where it is signage design and signage color. When we are talking about tenants and many tenants not just national tenant have an identity. They like to and they have a right to have that identity consistent with their various locations.

Frank Tortorello: They are not putting up all red signs in every Bank of America. I have seen many different styles.

Nancy Abramson: I don't think you would be putting that kind of sign up if you were in the Hampton or Bedford.

Frank Tortorello: It is not consistent with the things that are going on around it. It appears when this building was approved it was this type of signage. Now you come in and tell us you are not going to put a sign up in the tower that wasn't even a consideration. Now you have two of these on the side instead of three. That is a nice gesture and we appreciate it. I think you are going to have to go back to the drawing board and try to be responsive to what we as a board think is good for the community. I don't think having to shout out that we have another bank.

Anthony Montelone: What is the color that disturbs you?

Frank Tortorello: The lit channel letters right off the top. There seems to be a president in this building and I do believe that was the intent even if it is not written anywhere.

Nancy Abramson: All I want to say is whenever a new building goes up now we make everyone do something like this and we do give them the ability to change a little bit to express themselves. I am sure that this is what is expressed. That everyone is going to do something similar.

Anthony Montelone: I see similar in the paneling for the signage. We are staying within the paneling for the signage.

Nancy Abramson: The Target signs are all paneling and then the white letters. That is what we agreed.

Anthony Montelone: The Target sign is illuminated.

Nancy Abramson: We are not talking about Target we are talking about the shops. Target is very different than this building on South Moger Street.

Anthony Montelone: It is not like we are doing a Las Vegas billboard this is very discrete dignified lettering. I think we are within the parameters of good taste.

Frank Tortorello: It is a matte of personal opinion.

Anthony Montelone: Personal opinion has to have certain criteria.

Frank Tortorello: I do not think this is in good taste. That is their logo and they have been successful as a bank. The graphics are not much to brag about. I think that the intent of this approval when the building was approved that mounted the letters not illuminated letters. There is precedence for the other buildings on S. Moger and Bank of America should respect that.

Anthony Montelone; There is nothing in here that says letters couldn't be illuminated.

Frank Tortorello: I understand that but look around to the other buildings and see what is there and it is not this.

Anthony Montelone: What I really believe is when you look at the building all of these notations relate to the composition of the cut outs above those buildings not the signage. That green is in those cut outs. Everything there and the size of those cut outs depicts what exists without a sign in place not with a sign.

Nancy Abramson: It depicts the architectural style with gold leaf finish.

Anthony Montelone: Those cut outs are green and a gold leaf finish around the outside.

Steve Marrano: Do we have a picture of it.

(Viewing of photos)

Nancy Abramson: The whole point of those signs was to match the building. To make all one and entire statement. That was the concept

Of the gold leaf letters. The reason the other architect was here was he was trying to protect the integrity of the design. I would like to see that happen as well.

Anthony Montelone: I do not think that is possible. I would like to work with you.

Frank Tortorello: This board is not going to approve this. We are trying to get that message across.

Anthony Montelone: You are telling us you want green lettering or gold lettering in those locations.

Frank Tortorello: We would like you to put non illuminated individual pin mounted letters you have seen done.

Anthony Montelone: I am hearing you want gold letters.

Frank Tortorello: I think that we could look at something else. Everybody knows this is the Bank of America. People do not drive down the street saying look impulse buying there is Bank of America I think I will go in and buy something. That is not what a bank is. Yet everyone that comes in try to make the building a billboard. The building is not supposed to be to advertise the bank. The purpose of the signage is to identify what is there. This is not a retail strip where someone is going to see and let me stop to buy something. I don't think it makes any difference for your business. People are going to come to Bank of America not because of your sign. Maybe some people would be more favorably impressed if you were quiet about it. From my stand point this red is not great I could live with that. I would very much like to see this done differently. I would like to see it done in the context with the building before. Maybe not gold maybe white or off white. You can make it a metal or pin mounted lettering. I think it would be more consistent with what we are trying to do on the most important street in the village. There are a lot of stores that have a nice touch.

Anthony Montelone: What about illumination?

Frank Tortorello: I don't think you need it.

Diane Douglas: I am concerned with the entrance and where the 24 hour entrance is.

Anthony Montelone: Can we eliminate the one over the ATM?

Diane Douglas: I am hoping the building has illumination for security.

Frank Tortorello: There is plenty of light there. You are going to light the inside.

(Too Many People Speaking)

Anthony Montelone: Originally we had a sign on the inside for the ATM is that ok?

Frank Tortorello: The inside we have no jurisdiction over. For public safety you would have to do that.

Diane Douglas: I would like to do the mounted white lettering no illumination red sign over the door.

Frank Tortorello: Can we leave it to these two bays then? One on the entrance and one on this side. White pin mounted lettering. Can you come back with a sample?

This case will be returning.

Case #05-20

Lisa and Juan Ruiz, owners, and Kent Thuesen property owner

Juan Ruiz: We have a color change. It is not as bright as the last presentation.

Steve Marrano: This sign is going where the existing sign is now?

Juan Ruiz: Yes.

Kent Thuesen: The columns are a little bigger

Steve Marrano: The background color is all white. The other sign was a little darker.

Juan Ruiz: It is an off white.

Steve Marrano: How high is the sign now?

Juan Ruiz: It is the same height. Here are the pictures from every angle.

Frank Tortorello: We did talk about the sign and toning it down. You brought the photos. Are you using the existing posts?

Kent Thuesen: Yes.

Frank Tortorello: Now you are talking about 42 x 48.

Steve Marrano: You put this up on a platform.

Frank Tortorello: Is it 8 feet the ground or this raised area?

Kent Thuesen: It is the same height.

Frank Tortorello: Here you have the base and if you are gong by scale and this is 48 inches then it looks like the sign starts about 12 inches above the grade. 48 and 12 would be 58 which are 5 feet and not 8 feet. So which is it?

Kent Theusen: That is 8 feet the same as it is now.

Frank Tortorello: Then there is something wrong in this picture.

Juan Ruiz: It is from this point.

Frank Tortorello: it is not drawn that way is what I am trying to tell you. What you are showing us in this picture is not the case. It would be 4 feet off the ground. It would be a lot nicer than what you are showing here.

Kent Thuesen: There is a space here. This is 8 foot from here. This is 48 and this is 4 feet. It should be showing a 4 foot space right here. When Simon drew this he should have left a 4 foot space.

Frank Tortorello: This is nicer. I would say make this part 5 foot at the most. I think it looks nice like this. This looks like a gas station sign. This looks more like a restaurant sign. This is an off white background. This is the material for the sign?

Juan Ruiz: Yes.

Nancy Abramson: is this lit?

Juan Ruiz: Yes from the bottom.

Frank Tortorello: May I make a suggestion and pleas do not be offended. This to me looks like a kids cartoon.

Lisa Ruiz: They are coconuts.

Frank Tortorello: It doesn't look that way. I would think it would be a lot nicer if you just used the letters. I think it would make it a lot more refined looking. Every time I look at this I think someone is going to light the fuse. It doesn't come across the way you think it is going to come across. I think if you wrote CoCo the same way I think it would be really nice. It doesn't add anything.

Juan Ruiz: I have no objection to that.

Kent Thuesen: What if we did a real coconut?

Steve Marrano: How about just the O.

Kent Thuesen: An O it is.

Frank Tortorello: We are going to make this 5 foot 0 inches to 5 foot 6 inches. You can play with the height a little bit. This is going to be the letter O to match the rest of the design. I think you will be really happy with it.

Nancy Abramson: I make a motion that we accept as amended.

Steve Marrano: Second.

Board All Ayes.

Signage approved as amended.

New Cases:

CoCo Rumbas - 443 Lexington Ave

Case #05-28

Tom Sargent representing the applicant, Juan and Lisa Ruiz, Kent Thuesen, property owner.

Tom Sargent: We are not changing any of the structure of the building. We are changing some of the windows, the front door. We will paint this color. We are putting a tile roof. The framing might not support a full tile.

Nancy Abramson: Did you bring pictures?

Frank Tortorello: The building is stucco?

Tom Sargent: Yes it is stucco and here are the pictures.

(Viewing of the photos)

Frank Tortorello: What color are the windows yellow?

Tom Sargent: Gray.

Frank Tortorello: So you are changing the color?

Tom Sargent: There is a sample of it on the sample board.

Frank Tortorello: The roof is now what color?

Tom Sargent: It is a dark gray shingle.

Frank Tortorello: So you are going to strip it off and put this tile roof. Are you changing the pitch?

Tom Sargent: No we are not changing the pitch.

Frank Tortorello: Are you changing the door?

Tom Sargent: Yes. The door is brought forward a few feet.

Frank Tortorello: The door will be set back then? Are you extending this the whole front of the building?

Tom Sargent: Yes it is extended two feet forward.

Frank Tortorello: This whole element is being pulled out. These existing doors are staying back.

Tom Sargent: Actually they are being pulled forward also.

Frank Tortorello: These are just gates right?

Tom Sargent: They are glass.

Frank Tortorello: Are you cleaning up this parking lot?

Tom Sargent: Yes we are going to reseal it re-stripe the lines.

Steve Marrano: Are you cleaning up the front? Between the sidewalk and the road?

Kent Thuesen: I believe there is a new sidewalk.

Steve Marrano: What about the fence up front.

Kent Thuesen: That is coming down. I believe we are going to put shrubbery and bushes in that front area.

Steve Marrano: It needs to be cleaned up a lot.

Nancy Abramson: I like it.

Frank Tortorello: Any comments from the board.

Steve Marrano: I motion to accept it.

Nancy Abramson: Second.

Frank Tortorello: Board all ayes. Accepted as presented. You are good to go.

Returning Cases:

Case #05-13

Jackie Giaimo: We meet a few months ago and talked about the renovation/addition on our property. I have a revised plan and hopefully will clarify a lot. We also took into consideration your suggestions from our last meeting.

Frank Tortorello: These are the revised?

Jackie Giaimo: That is right. These have a lot more detail. This was not drawn in the last time. We clarified the material we are using.

Frank Tortorello: This is the addition. This is the street side?

Jackie Giaimo: Yes.

Frank Tortorello: So you are filling in. That is the existing roof line. You are raising this also.

Jackie Giaimo: Yes.

Frank Tortorello: You are raising it up so that it is going to be higher behind it.

Steve Marrano: That is existing?

Frank Tortorello: It does not really exist. What you see is this being raised up. Right now it looks lower than the existing roof. I think you have to raise it because you are extending the house over. So you have to raise the ridge to keep it symmetrical. These are the other houses on the street?

Jackie Giaimo: That is right. These are the colors of the vinyl siding. Just to give you an idea of the color scheme this is someone's house and I think this comes together in terms of showing what it is we are going to do. Beige siding and this red.

Frank Tortorello: You have that brick?

Jackie Giaimo: Yes in the entry way.

Frank Tortorello: Is it all brick?

Jackie Giaimo: Yes.

Frank Tortorello: Is this brick here or wood?

Jackie Giaimo: That is siding.

Frank Tortorello: That is pushed back. Are these the existing windows?

Jackie Giaimo: We are replacing all the windows in the house.

Frank Tortorello: Any reason why they are not the same size?

Jackie Giaimo: This is a sitting room in the front and the addition and this is a walk in closet and actually it is elevated from the addition. I don't know if we can go that far.

Frank Tortorello: This is higher.

John Giaimo: In order to get into this room we have to have a couple of steps.

Frank Tortorello: So you are matching. This whole thing is a step up?

Jackie Giaimo: Yes.

Nancy Abramson: What would you suggest there?

Frank Tortorello: Try to keep it the same proportion. You are saying this is one step up, but it looks like four steps up. This is a very low window. Could it be like that? Right now it looks like your window is about a foot or less. It is about 18-20 inches off the floor. These look like they are probably three feet off the floor.

Jackie Giaimo: We can try to expand those windows to make them match.

Frank Tortorello: I think it would look nicer, if you could bring them down a little bit.

John Giaimo: But we do not want to bring them down to the floor either.

Frank Tortorello: You can certainly bring them down a foot and make them a little more consistent and more gracious walking down. This is what you are trying to do with the rest of the house.

Nancy Abramson: That is a really good idea.

Frank Tortorello: It is not a big deal to lower the window; it is a big job to raise them. You might want to think about that. Bring them down about a foot or 16 inches and I think it will look nicer. This is the 64 thousand dollar question and I never ask it but it looks like it would be nice with shutters on it.

Jackie Giaimo: We had a discussion about that.

Frank Tortorello: They have to be the same size as the window. They have to look like they really work and actually close the window.

Jackie Giaimo: This is actually the look that doesn't have shutters and has nice window trim around it and I thought it would be great just to have this.

Nancy Abramson: I could go either way. The thing I feel strong about shutters is exactly what Frank said it has to look like they are suppose to close verses just a piece of aluminum.

Frank Tortorello: Sometimes they are smaller than the window.

Jackie Giaimo: We did look at a lot of windows. This seemed like it worked.

Steve Marrano: I have no objections.

Frank Tortorello: There is still not a lot of detail and you can do it nicely and simply and you need to make it not like it came from a box. I think you are trying to make that not happen. You might want to consider is returning the brick on this side. It would be visually a lot nicer if you returned the brick here. I am just suggesting. I think you would be happy if you could do that. It would make it look substantial as opposed to looking like it was glued on. Do we have a motion?

Nancy Abramson: I make a motion that we accept with the changes to the windows.

Steve Marrano: Second

Frank Tortorello: Board all ayes. Approved as noted with the changes to the windows.

Case #05-23

Angela Benaissa: This is the survey of the land.

Nancy Abramson: This is the house?

(Viewing of the photos and drawings)

Frank Tortorello: So this is the existing house and you are adding a modular.

Angela Benaissa: The original house was built in 1929. The previous owner tacked this onto the front which is the view right here.

Frank Tortorello: This is what you see now.

Angela Benaissa: We want to take this down and replace it with this.

Frank Tortorello: The addition on the back and the front doesn't change. You are tearing this whole thing down. This is all going to match. What color are the shutters dark green? I think the dark green is softer than the black. The roof is going to match and going to be gray. You are going to match this look on the doors.

Angela Benaissa: This garage will be equal to the basement in the house.

Frank Tortorello: What is in the back now?

Angela Benaissa: Actually it looks very top heavy now.

Frank Tortorello: There are no trees on this street?