ARB Minutes - July 20, 2005

Minutes

Architectural Review Board

Village/Town of Mount Kisco

July 20, 2005

Members in Attendance: Frank Tortorello

Nancy Abramson

Steve Marrano

Ann Houck

Members Absent:

Meeting called to order 7:30 p.m.

Minutes from July 20, 2005 to be voted on at next meeting

Returning Cases:

Case #05-32 Ted Straus Attorney for applicant

Ted Strauss: We are here before tonight to review the approval for an awning and approval for the storefront. The work has already been done. The only lettering on the awning will be Carlyle Jewelers. The color of the awning will be burgundy and there is no lighting.

Frank Tortorello: The original awning has been removed?

Ted Strauss: Yes

Frank Tortorello: Do we have a motion?

Nancy Abramson: I motion we accept as presented.

Steve Marrano: Second

Frank Tortorello: Board All Ayes. I strongly urge what is here was built. To some degree we are going to look to you Mr. Strauss to oversee that.

Case #04-65 - Robert Tolchin, Tolchin Property Group representing the applicant

Robert Tolchin: We were here back in December for our sign and were asked to come back with a change of color. Our previous color was a bronze which the owners wanted to change to a blue and your board suggested that it be toned down. The reason for the blue is because this is a medical facility. This seems to be a corner stone for many medical facilities. We went back to the drawing board and getting all the people together to agree upon a color. We came up with is what we consider to be a complimentary color that was not necessarily as garish as the blue was. It compliments the buildings. The buildings next to the sign are a brown with green trim. As well we have landscaped through there. We have some very nice greenery. We then finally agreed on a green that is very dark. The finish will be the same as the original sign in terms of lettering. This is the sample we would like your approval on. This is a color that everyone was happy with. We feel that it is attractive and very complimentary. This is the last part of the process for us to go forward.

Frank Tortorello: This application still says bronze. Do we have a photo of the last approved sign?

Nancy Placona: Yes, I brought the photos.

Robert Tolchin: This is the original sign that was approved.

Frank Tortorello: This is a two face sign and non illuminated.

Robert Tolchin: It is not illuminated interior but up lit. This is the sample of the color that we are proposing.

Frank Tortorello: The application needs to be changed to read a dark green clear coat finish. There should have been an amended application only because this is what goes into the file. This should reflect what you are going to do. The text is going to stay the same?

Robert Tolchin. Instead of the abbreviation Mt. we are going to spell it out to Mount.

Nancy Abramson: I make a motion to accept as presented.

Steve Marrano: Second.

Frank Tortorello: Board All Ayes.

Case #05-34 - Desta Lakew, Dan Hollis attorney for the applicant.

Dan Hollis: The reason for the sign being in the back is not one of our own choosing. That was a condition that was imposed on us by the Zoning Board at their March 30^th 2004 meeting. We needed to get some variances with regard to parking. I have a copy of the resolution for you. It said that Open Door would agree to use the front door of the building on West Main Street as an exit only and would signs and notices at that door and within its offices in Spanish and English advising patients and staff of the restrictions. The only entrance to the building is around the rear. As part of this implementation of this condition Open Door would direct all patients to use the rear entrance only. So we would be in compliance with all the resolution. We understand last month when we were here pointing out the prototypes of the signs for the front and the back that the board was discouraged by the color of the signs not the size of the signs. We took those comments to heart and we went back to the drawing board to try and find a color blue that would be a little more muted and make it more to your liking.

Frank Tortorello: Let me see the drawings of the size and placement of the signs.

Dan Hollis: These are the drawings.

Nancy Abramson: We did have conversation of the sin in the back turning into an awning.

Dan Hollis: There will have to be a sign to show the way. We were not aware that the Zoning Board pushed you this way.

Frank Tortorello: We felt that once someone turned the corner they would immediately rather than see the sign this way they would be able to see the awning projecting from the door.

Dan Hollis: We started this in the early fall of 2003. We have been at his approval process for nearly two years. It has been a long hard struggle and this is our last hurdle.

Nancy Abramson: I totally understand. The reason I ask is usually I know the Planning Board is really sensitive to residential next to quote unquote commercial. What Frank pointed out and what we were concerned about is the sign on the street that is mostly residential. Every time someone is walking down that street this is what they are going to see.

Dan Hollis: We will be flush against the building. Some of the alternatives that we have were the color. Hopefully you will like them. We don't want the sign exceedingly dis similar to what is around town. We have a color chart working off what the sign looks like. The problem going back a minute to the Chairman's question about an awning. An awning while it presents its own set of problems with regard to heat and dripping and birds. It may not be the most apropos or appropriate solution. If you take a look at the colors and the pacific blue, and Mediterranean blue are two color alternatives that are far more muted than what appeared in our original proposal. Which were the corporate theme colors? Either of those two colors are acceptable to you and obviously all the signs will be that color. We sent our troops out and about to photograph some of the signs around town.

Nancy Abramson: I think the issue that we were talking about that this particular building is the gateway to Mt. Kisco. It is a very well traveled area.

Desta Lakew: Actual the sign in the front will be smaller.

Frank Tortorello: This is not going to be illuminated but ground lit?

Dan Hollis: Yes. We couldn't get around the sign in the back. Let's go back to what Ms. Abramson said. The reason for the rear entrance was I said during the Planning Board that a lot of our patience and clients would come by public transportation, because there is bus stop right there. People were worried about cars queuing up on West Main Street. The Planning Board and Zoning Board said then we will leave it at that by not having the front be an entrance. Once people get use to that they won't drop people off on that location. We have parking behind the building and have arranged for parking in the municipal lot next the church on Maple Ave. We have 12 spaces there.

Frank Tortorello: Can we put a directional sign in the front. You have a sign here that identifies the building. How about a sign like this and I would think that we would go home. There is no way to gracefully put that sign on the building. I think that if you get people around the building there is only one door they can't miss it. They don't need this to tell them where to go.

Desta Lakew: I do not have any problem making the sign a little smaller and putting it over the door.

Frank Tortorello: What is your objection if we asked you to put a little awning that projected with the canopy and put your name on this side people would be able to find the door. As soon as they turn the corner they are going to spot this. When they turn the corner now they don't know where the door is.

Desta Lakew: I don't have a problem with it but in our lease there would be a problem to install that.

Frank Tortorello: This doesn't have to be big.

Dan Hollis: Our preference is not to do that. We have been through the wringer on this application. Operationally what we conceded to on this rear entrance is not operationally good for us. That was our concession to the other boards. Having conceded to that, I have had to swallow this as a condition of the ZBA approval and I wasn't happy about it. I didn't know what your thoughts would be on the rear entrance but this is something we are stuck with.

Frank Tortorello: Can you cut the size of the sign in the back?

Desta Lakew: We can cut the size.

Frank Tortorello: Also keep that shape. I also think that if you put it next to the door I think it would be more attractive. You can put it above the door and use the width of the door. That is a possibility. It is to be no bigger than the width of the door.

Desta Lakew: These are our corporate colors.

Frank Tortorello: Everyone comes in with the same and all their corporate colors. The Mediterranean blue is not bad. What if you could replicate one of those two swatches? If they made the sign half the size or roughly the width of the door would that be ok? I can be ok with the blue. Unfortunately there are not enough colors here. From my perspective I am ok with the blue but Nancy is uncomfortable with that.

Nancy Abramson: I know that there are more blues than what was presented.

Frank Tortorello: Can you drop off color samples to the office for Nancy and Ann to review? Would you volunteer to be a committee of two to make a decision on the color?

Nancy Abramson: Sure.

Frank Tortorello: Bring in real color samples and not fabrics.

Nancy I would like to see something a little richer and deeper.

Frank Tortorello: Drop off the samples at the building department.

This will be a conditional approval. We have a motion for a conditional of approval of the sign in the front and the new sign is approved with the condition that you bring in additional samples to be reviewed. The board will abide by the decision of Nancy Abramson and Ann Houck for determination of color.

Steve Marrano: Second.

Frank Tortorello: Board All Ayes.

Case #05-14 Stephen Siegfried, project Solutions, and Jerry Boland, The Boland Studios.

Jerry Boland: This is the child care center that has been before you once before and we would like to present the materials that the board requested on our last appearance. Questions were raised as to the quality of the construction.

Frank Tortorello: I would like to report for the record that all applicants should bring with them all contents of their previous appearances.

Jerry Boland: You had suggested to us to present samples of the materials use to show the quality of the building. It is a precast building with a textured paint and makes it look like a plaster building. These are photographs of buildings that I have done. This is pre cast building. What these show is how crisp the building is. You also wanted to see samples of the finish that we would put on. This is the actual color of what we would be using. Steve went to the site and took photos of the neighboring commercial buildings. So we could get a feel of what type of sign to be done. It would be fairly modest. As well as the façade being approved we have two signs for approval. What we would like to have in signage is a sign on the canopy. Our previous presentation was a 30 x 20 sign that was blue, so we reduced the sign on the building and we have added a monument sign internally lit. This is the actual storefront. This is the color and it would be a tinted glass. These are the plaster samples. This is the view from the post office.

Frank Tortorello: The other sign you want where?

Jerry Boland: The monument sign was not shown on the previous presentation. This is 6 feet high and the letters are 12 inches high.

Frank Tortorello: Can you reduce it? We did not approve the building the last time?

Jerry Boland: No you wanted us to bring you samples of the materials.

Frank Tortorello: You brought this and this is the finish. Did you bring any glass? Are there different planes, because I do not see that here in the drawings? We don't have anything that shows the original sign. This is the biggest sign?

Jerry Boland This is 24 x 36. This is the correct sign.

Frank Tortorello: Where are the drawings that show the elevation?

Jerry Boland: I think there is a package missing.

Frank Tortorello: We are not trying to give you a hard time I think we need to see the entire rendering. This doesn't show very much. It is going to take more than this to go on. Are these are vertical and soft joints.

Nancy Abramson: There is no other submission.

Frank Tortorello: We have no objections to the conceptual design but we will need to see more of it. It is hard for me to see that this building is going to be as attractive as it should be and I need to be certain. I don't think we are at that point.

Stephen Seigfried: we built this building and we will be using this same technique.

Frank Tortorello: How far are you along in this process?

Jerry Boland: We are still waiting on some DEP issues and it has been four months since we heard.

Frank Tortorello: You will have to come back with more photographs and a better drawing of elevations. I would really like to see it and we want to make it right.

Jerry Boland: Can we focus on the sign?

Frank Tortorello: I believe it will be all ok given the area that this is in.

Ann Houck: There are actually 3 signs on the canopy.

Frank Tortorello: This is not what they are submitting. They are only going to put one sign on the building and one pylon sign.

Nancy Abramson: Where are the signs going to be located?

Jerry Boland: At the front of the building.

Frank Tortorello: We need to see the detail of all the signs. This is only a sketch. Is this ground lit and sample of the materials? This is a day care center?

Jerry Boland: Yes.

Frank Tortorello: This is the type of signage that we are looking for. Not a type of retail sign. We urge you to get the rest of the package and show all the elevations return next month.

Jerry Boland: Thank you for your time.

Frank Tortorello: I don't think that we have a problem with the building that we need to see better drawings of the elevations and we will see you in September.

New Cases:

Case #05-36 John Canida representing the applicant.

John Canida: Our goal is to replace the existing sign out front and the sign above the front door.

Nancy Abramson: Is there a color?

John Canida: I put in color copies with my submission.

Steve Marrano: This is red, I think it is to bold.

Frank Tortorello: What is the name of you business?

John Canida: Cousins Paintball.

Frank Tortorello: Why does this say paintball supplies?

John Canida: I wanted to keep it simple. I wanted to do something not complaining to the town what I thought the motif of that structure should be so I just put up paintball supplies.

Nancy Abramson: is this all red?

John Canida: No this is it right here.

Frank Tortorello: You need to put the name of the business not paintball supplies.

Steve Marrano: This is to bold.

John Canida: Whatever color you choose we will be fine. It is possible that the name will not be Cousins Paintball. We are in the process of a merger.

Frank Tortorello: Can I make a suggestion? We will probably want to see it again and why don't you apply for a temporary sign and go for a less bold sign.

John Canida: I just want to get a sign up and whatever color you think is best I will go with. We applied for a temporary sign and it was rejected.

Nancy Placona: Austin would not approve it because they wanted to cover the entire sign and that was not acceptable. They wanted to cover the entire pylon.

Frank Tortorello: This sign that you asked for covered the entire pylon.

John Canida: The sign inside the door nobody can see.

Frank Tortorello: Can I request that Mr. Cassidy reconsider a temporary sign just the size of the text on the pylon sign. Then when the company name settles down then they can come back to us with their sign. You have to get the name of the company straight and tone the color down. Blues and greens are easier colors. You wouldn't have trouble with that and come down in size.

John Canida: I can use variations of all of them. The background should be what color.

Steve Marrano; Go with a dark green and beige lettering.

John Canida: I can have this tomorrow.

Nancy Placona: Mr. Cassidy is on vacation this week so call the office next Monday and I will speak with him on getting a temporary sign up.

John Canida: So I can't do anything now? The real estate sign that is posted there is that a violation?

Nancy Placona: I have the code here and the board has no jurisdiction over that.

Frank Tortorello: We need to put that on our agenda to try to make a change in the code for that. Thank you for coming.

Case #05-37 Kevin Hymowitz applicant

Kevin Hymowitz: We are going into the old paintball place. If you look at the documents I have brought that shows several different variations. Tab 3 will show you the most inclusive of the presentation fro the corporation. WE are in the process of remodeling the inside. We are power washing the outside of the building and leaving the area above the store white to match the brick where the sign will go. We are hoping to have the rose colored sign with the turquoise blue.

Frank Tortorello: Is there to be lighting?

Kevin Hymowitz: If you turn to tab three it will show that there is lighting above the door. If you see the cross section you will see the lighting better.

Nancy Abramson: We are not going to let you put the name on an awning and a sign. We cannot let you do both.

Steve Marrano: There is too much going on.

Kevin Hymowitz: If you look at tabs 3, we have thrown everything at you. 4,5,6,7 are other variations of what it could like. Tab 5 we could take off the pink border. It is just what the corporate logo goes on.

Nancy Abramson: Where else are you located?

Kevin Hymowitz: There will be one at the Palisades. This looks bright, but it is not as bright as you think. There is nothing wrong with happy.

Frank Tortorello: You are right. Look at the Bellizzi sign and this was not an approved sign. That is more than we would have approved.

Nancy Abramson: We did do On The One and the Art Emporium.

Frank Tortorello: It is always difficult when someone comes in with a logo and a franchise and they say this is what it has to be. How can we address this and keep everybody happy? You have too much on one sign.

Kevin Hymowitz: The window sign can be gone.

Frank Tortorello: This picture number 6 would be acceptable from my stand point. Say Maggie Moo's is the only illuminated sign and the letters on the sign board. The awning should be much smaller letters. You need an address somewhere. This is an ice crème place. A white awning will not stay white for very long.

Nancy Abramson: You know I have a problem if it is pink or red.

Frank Tortorello: That is why we are here to talk about it. This is something a little different.

Nancy Abramson: You are right this is whimsical.

Frank Tortorello: If you did this and you brought it down a little bit and centered it on here and do ice crème and treatery in three inch high painted and keep this whether it had the cow or not. You would still have a little whimsical. I could live with that.

Kevin Hymowitz: We knew number 3 was not going to fly. I would be happy to take the band off the awning.

Nancy Abramson: Where is the address going?

Frank Tortorello: You can have it on the door. Center Maggie Moo's and treatery in smaller letters.

Frank Tortorello: This basically stays the same but center. You have to visually center it. These letters will be painted or even channel letters.

Kevin Hymowitz: The ice crème treatery can that be channel letters but not illuminated?

Frank Tortorello: They can be cut out but not project out. These will be channel as shown but not illuminated. It might be better if you split it. Individual pin mounted letters. It is a thin stroke and I will think it would be ok.

Steve Marrano: What are the store hours?

Kevin Hymowitz: Up to 9:00 p.m. The previous tenant put a light bulb under the awning and shielded it. They were recessed lighting.

Frank Tortorello: My recommendation would be to leave Maggie Moo's lettering six inches high, illuminate all text and have the band removed from the awning.

Kevin Hymowitz: We were afraid we were going to lose the awning. I am happy.

Steve Marrano: I make a motion to accept as noted.

Nancy Abramson: Second

Frank Tortorello: Board All Ayes.

Kevin Hymowitz: If we decide to make changes what do we have to do?

Frank Tortorello: You will have to come back before the board.

Case #05-39 - Jo Pearlman owner and applicant

Jo Pearlman: We are on the parking lot side in the Elephant Trunk's building across the street. After a year and a half of being in business we have people coming in and saying I didn't know you were here. They can't see us from the street they can only see us from one direction. What we are proposing is a simple free standing sign not lit and the same color as the trim on the building stating Chiara Scura shoes and handbags.

Nancy Abramson: You are in the parking lot?

Jo Pearlman: There is a curb and then the curb cut.

Frank Tortorello: This is a monument sign.

Jo Pearlman: There is a curb so it would sit back from that. There is grading and it would sit back.

Nancy Abramson: I still don't see it.

Frank Tortorello: You have your name on the canopy there already?

Jo Pearlman: Yes but you cannot see it. It faces the parking lot. The first awning says Elephants Trunk we are the second and third.

Nancy Abramson: What are these signs?

Jo Pearlman: Those are not permanent signs. Those are all coming down once this goes up.

Frank Tortorello: There are a lot of examples of this type of signage. There are a number of stores off of Lexington Avenue where they are on corners and have little signs that are perpendicular to the street into little alley ways. They have signs on the front of the building. Nobody has pylon signs.

Jo Pearlman: Yes they do. What about where Luna is?

Frank Tortorello: That is a little different.

Jo Pearlman: This is not lit.

Frank Tortorello: You are not listening. Let me finish. When we approved all the stores where Chicos is and along that alley. Nowhere on Lexington Avenue is there a pylon sign that says in this little side street we have this business.

Jo Pearlman: Those are side streets as opposed to this; this is part of the Elephant Trunks building. Dorothy Stein has a frontage and the Elephant Trunk has a frontage we do not have a frontage. We asked if we could put a banner sign so that people could see us from the street. We were told there were enough signs on the building. They told us no more signs. This is much more tasteful than these signs. It matches the building and it would help for people to know we are there.

Frank Tortorello: What happens if someone takes the store next to you? Do we have a second application?

Jo Pearlman: It is part of a free sanding building.

Frank Tortorello: I know the building we approved it. We spent a lot of time approving that building and one of the things I am most proud of. We are very much aware of the building. I am also aware that there is no precedence for this. I don't think I am about to establish that.

Jo Pearlman: What is the difference if they have free standing signs and we want to make it more attractive by putting up our sign? It is on their property. It matches the building. Unfortunately the architect was supposed to make a common entrance and things were switched around and then there wasn't the common entrance.

Frank Tortorello: When did you go into this building?

Jo Pearlman: We are the last tenant.

Frank Tortorello: How did he know about the common entrance if he didn't know you existed?

Jo Pearlman: The building was not built.

Frank Tortorello: You have been in the building since the bu