ARB Minutes 4-16-08

Minutes

Architectural Review Board

Village/Town of Mount Kisco

Wednesday April 16, 2008

Meeting called to order at 7:30 pm, Wednesday April 16, 2008, at the Municipal Building Mount Kisco, New York.

Members Present: Chairman Kevin Kelly

Anne Houck

Bruce Hartleben

Patty Kiernan

Members Absent: Nancy Abramson

Staff Present: None

Staff Absent: Austin Cassidy

Returning Cases:

1. John Bucolo Case #ARB08-04

117 St. Marks Place Residential/

Mount Kisco, New York 10549 New Construction

John Bucolo, applicant

Tim Bucolo, applicant's contractor

Chairman Kelly: Welcome back. Just to be fair we have a new board member so if you can walk us through your application.

John Bucolo: The residence is at 117 St Marks Place we will demo the residence. A new house will be constructed. There was an issue last month with the plan and how the house looked. I have the new plans with me so you can see how the house will look. I also have photographs of the neighboring homes on the street. (Viewing of the photographs)

Chairman Kelly: This gives us a better scale of the neighboring homes.

John Bucolo: The issue with the window, I removed the window since it was not necessary by code. I removed it completely and will be putting a light by the stairs.

Chairman Kelly: I know last time you seemed to be confused as to why the window was there.

John Bucolo: The window was at the landing of the stairs, but I took it out and will replace it with a light.

Chairman Kelly: Do you want to walk us through the materials?

John Bucolo: The material is cement board.

Chairman Kelly: Pre-finished and the color.

John Bucolo: Yes and the color will be around this color, in the green, putty color. This is the roofing. It is the architectural roofing. The color will be around the charcoal to black. The windows are pre-finished white. The stone in the front is real stone.

Chairman Kelly: White columns, white railings?

John Bucolo: Yes.

Chairman Kelly: The porch is made out of…

John Bucolo: It will be flagstone and everything else will be wood with the stone background.

Bruce Hartleben: The only change from the plans from last month is the removal of the window?

John Bucolo: Yes and you wanted a detail of the spindles and we enlarged that for you. Everything including the steps was done to code.

Chairman Kelly: Any questions or comments?

Anne Houck: He has responded to all of our concerns.

Chairman Kelly: The double reverse gable detail is keeping with the nature of the neighborhood.

Bruce Hartleben: Yes that helped a lot.

John Bucolo: I wanted to keep with the design of the neighborhood and not stick out.

Anne Houck: I move that we accept the application for the Bucolo residents' as presented.

Bruce Hartleben: Second

Anne Houck: Aye on the motion

Bruce Hartleben: Aye on the second.

Patty Kiernan: Aye

Chairman Kelly: Aye

New Cases:

1. CVS/Pharmacy/Poyant Sign Case #ARB08-14

421 Main Street Signage

Mount Kisco, New York 10549

Gary McCoy, Poyant Sign

William Null, attorney

Gary McCoy: This is an application on behalf of the new CVS Pharmacy at the corner of Main St and Rt. 172. Basically we want to replace existing signs that was installed with the Stop & Shop and before that Grand Union. The size of the signs in many instances has been reduced from what it has been. There is a pre-existing sign variance for it to be the size that it was. We are scaling sown.

Chairman Kelly: Let's walk through location. The applicant is aware that there is a new sign ordinance in the works and there will be some potential change.

Gary McCoy: Yes. The main sign that is on the north side of the building. This would be the one that is replacing the old Stop & Shop sign. That is an internally lit channel letters and is the same type of sign that was for Stop & Shop.

Chairman Kelly: Let's take them one at a time. How big is it and how long is it, how high?

Gary McCoy: It is 33 square feet and it 24 inches high.

William Null: It is 23.4 square feet and 16'.9” long.

Chairman Kelly: That is mounted on the parfait?

Gary McCoy: Yes.

Chairman Kelly: Let's go through the whole packet and then discuss them.

Gary McCoy: The next sign is a free standing and there are two and they are located at each entrance as you can see on the site plan they are identified as pylon 1 & 2. What we propose to do there is to replace the plastic. This is an internally lit sign. If you look at page one the background is going to be opaque so at night when it lights up the only items that will illuminate will be the letters and the background will be dark. On page two we have and enter and exit sign at each curb cut. They are non-illuminated and only vinyl poly-graphic.

Chairman Kelly: C2 is that in the right of way?

Gary McCoy: It looks like we are at…

William Null: What is marked is the twenty foot setback not the right of way. The property line is the outer bounds.

Chairman Kelly: So it is within the twenty foot setback.

Gary McCoy: On your last page we have three incidental signs. The first one being a small plaque that goes nest to the front door and it says CVS/Pharmacy and it has the hours of operation. This is non-illuminated. The sign below that is an 18” x 24” and it is placed at the receiving door at the rear of the building. This store is slotted to be a twenty four hour operation and the last sign we are proposing is a neon skeletal sign that hangs in the window. That is on the front elevation to the right of the entrance. That would be the entire package.

William Null: The neon sign is setback over 100 feet from Rt. 172.

Chairman Kelly: Conceptually I understand what we are doing for the main sign on the building. It is proportionate to the building. What jumps out at me and partly a concern that the two pylon signs that we have right now will probably be changing in the near future. The scale and size of these is pretty enormous. I know that you have a right to do them in the past. This is the same use?

Nancy Placona: Yes. This project is not currently before the board. According to conversations and meetings with the applicant, once the store is opened the applicant has stated that they will be applying to the Planning Board for some site changes.

Chairman Kelly: My other concern is the enter and exit signs and at that height there may be some road and site line visibility issues. Someone needs to pay attention to the height of those signs. I understand the intention of it.

William Null: At 3'4” you would consider that a problem?

Chairman Kelly: When you are sitting in your car that is pretty close to eye shot. Austin is not here to talk about this tonight, but that is something that you might want to take a look at. It is more of a logistics.

The neon we are not favorable with the neon and would like to see them disappear. I understand the signage at the door and at the back and we will talk about that. Any comments?

Bruce Hartleben: All good point and I do not have any questions.

Anne Houck: The two issues I think that we have questions about is the pylon sign in this district of the town. The new regulations will prohibit those and you would have to take them down.

William Null: We do not have a problem with that.

Anne Houck: It meets code currently.

Chairman Kelly: The reason I ask you and unless this is in the interest of time to get the store opened. Recently in front of this board some of our automobile dealers have come in and we have discussed it. They have designed different types of standing ground pylon signs which I know CVS has in their arsenal of signs like that. Would the applicant think about maybe doing that now verses rather than caring it out in short order?

William Null: We are actually using an existing base. Our preference would be to use the existing base and then come back and replace it after the store is opened.

Gary McCoy: My understanding is that there is a second phase and I am not privy to. My objective here tonight is to get identification on the building so when they are ready to open they have signage.

Anne Houck: I guess our concern with the neon is that it will be phased out in the new code.

Chairman Kelly: I think that here are other ways to treat this secondary sign. I do not have a problem with the 24 hour sign it could be down lit and you can spot it.

Gary McCoy: I do not think that it would be as visible from the road.

Chairman Kelly: We would like you to walk out of here with as much as you can.

Gary McCoy: This is a really good location for a 24 hour store. We want to let people know that we are open 24 hours instead of just having the lights on. Visibility from Rt. 172 will be difficult.

Anne Houck: It meets code now it probably will not with the new ordinance. We are just informing you.

William Null: Does that mean when the new code comes out that any existing neon signs in town will be taken down?

Anne Houck: Over a period of time.

Nancy Placona: It will be determined by the cost of the sign which will decide the length of time the applicant will have to remove the sign and comply with the new code.

Chairman Kelly: Do we want to take these one at a time?

Anne Houck: My only thought is that they meet the current code.

Nancy Placona: As a footnote to the applicant. The twenty four hour sign needs to be represented at 30% of a window pane. So this will go even smaller. The future code the percentage will be 25%.

Anne Houck: Out of curiosity is there anything going to be happening with the bank portion of the building.

William Null: Not to my knowledge.

Chairman Kelly: Let's start with the main building sign.

Anne Houck: I move that we accept the main building sign as presented.

Bruce Hartleben: Second:

Anne Houck: Aye on the motion

Bruce Hartleben: Aye, on the second

Patty Kiernan: Aye

Chairman Kelly: Aye.

Board All Ayes on the Main Building Sign.

Chairman Kelly: The plaque sign at the entrance door.

Anne Houck: I move that we accept the secondary sign indicating the hours of operation as presented.

Bruce Hartleben: Second

Anne Houck: Aye, on the motion

Bruce Hartleben: Aye, on the second

Patty Kiernan: Aye.

Chairman Kelly: Aye.

Board All Ayes on the hours of operation sign

Chairman Kelly: The next is the receiving entrance sign.

Bruce Hartleben: I move that we accept it as presented.

Anne Houck: Second.

Bruce Hartleben: Aye, on the motion

Anne Houck: Aye, on the second

Patty Kiernan: Aye.

Chairman Kelly: Aye.

Board All Ayes on the receiving entrance sign.

Chairman Kelly: The open 24 hour sign

Anne Houck: As presented it does not meet the code.

Chairman Kelly: It will have to be reduced no matter what.

Anne Houck: What is your suggestion as to how to change it?

Gary McCoy: I do not know the calculations of the window.

Chairman Kelly: As I look at the picture now it is filling the entire window pane.

Gary McCoy: I am saying that we will comply with the 30% coverage.

Chairman Kelly: So it will be reduced in compliance.

Bruce Hartleben: I move that we accept with the change that the sign will only cover 30% of the pane.

Anne Houck: Second.

Bruce Hartleben: Aye, on the motion

Anne Houck: Aye, on the second

Patty Kiernan: Aye.

Chairman Kelly: Aye.

Board All Ayes as noted to meet 30% coverage on the 24 Hour neon sign.

Chairman Kelly: Now let's talk about the pylon signs. There are two?

Gary McCoy: There are two existing now.

William Null: There are also two key entrances off of two main roads.

Anne Houck: It is a corner building and you are entitled to two signs under the current code and under future code given the setback and size of the building.

Chairman Kelly: So we are going to stay with the way it is with the understanding that the new code is coming shortly and you will probably be back in front of us.

William Null: Yes.

Anne Houck: I move that we approve the pylon signs as presented and that complies with the current sign code.

Bruce Hartleben: Second.

Anne Houck: Aye, on the motion

Bruce Hartleben: Aye, on the second

Patty Kiernan: Aye.

Chairman Kelly: Aye.

Chairman Kelly: Please make sure that the entrance and exit signs do not obscure any site lines.

Gary McCoy: This is a standard height and used everywhere.

William Null: I think one of the key issues is the site line. We are back twenty feet. We will check. We don't want any accidents either.

Nancy Placona: Maybe you should request the applicant to provide a site line elevation for those signs when applying for the sign permit.

Chairman Kelly: Please verify the site lines.

Gary McCoy: Can we put up a banner for grand opening?

Nancy Placona: Not on the outside of the building and no more than 305 of the interior window whether it a window pane or a full glass window.

2. Facelogic Skin Care & Spa Case #ARB08-15

145 Kisco Avenue Signage

Mount Kisco, New York 10549

John Oliva C&M Sign, representing the applicant

John Oliva: I will make this easy. It is fairly simple. This is for 145 Kisco Ave. It is an all electric sign building. All the signs are similar. On the first page on the bottom some of the other signs. The middle picture is one that was a previous tenant. This tenant is a skin care day spa. And is a franchise, so the color scheme is from their design using their corporate colors and type face. The layout is to fit the 2 x 15 area. We would make the background opaque and the light would show through the letters.

Chairman Kelly: Just an observation. When I look at “essential skincare spa” I can't even see it.

John Oliva: It is pretty small.

Chairman Kelly: I think it is a great looking sign. I think it is creative.

John Oliva: They put the two fonts together and they down play that. You are right. Maybe I can cut off some of the circles and move everything over. Would I have to resubmit if I changed the scale of the lettering?

Chairman Kelly: WE can make notation here.

John Oliva: It is going to be the same design. I don't think I could make it a lot bigger.

Chairman Kelly: The problem is that you don't want to start to over power the rest of the sign.

John Oliva: The problem is if you add a little bit of height it does get longer. If I tool out the half circles and moved it over.

Chairman Kelly: Is that their graphics?

John Oliva: What they do is take that design and use it in all different places and obviously all different media. They do not have many franchises. They usually use channel letters. The background is pretty muted. Then there is this directory that no one like and we have to deal with that. All the panels are the same, color and no graphics.

Anne Houck: It is a lovely sign. You did stay with the look and style of the building.

John Oliva: She did mention a wood sign but she would have to come back and the whole package. I believe that most of these are hanging cabinets.

Chairman Kelly: Comments?

Bruce Hartleben: I like it and it might blend in a little too well.

Anne Houck: It is modern but does have a feminine appeal to it.

Chairman Kelly: Do we want to keep it as is?

John Oliva: I am going to change it slightly.

Chairman Kelly: What are you thinking?

John Oliva: I was going to cut some of the circles off and make it 5% larger.

Chairman Kelly: We are taking these circles out and moving everything over which will allow the secondary portion of the sign to increase up to 5%

Bruce Hartleben: I move that we accept the sign with the changes that the left half circle row be removed and the type can shift left. Facelogic remains the same and the “essential skincare spa” can increase up to 5% to increase visibility

Anne Houck: Second

Bruce Hartleben: Aye, on the motion

Anne Houck: Aye, on the second

Patty Kiernan: Aye

Chairman Kelly: Aye.

Board All Ayes on the Motion to approve as noted.

3. Amy & Keith Ferguson Case #ARB08-12

54 Hillside Ave Alterations/

Mount Kisco, New York 10549 Overhang

Amy Ferguson, applicant

Amy Ferguson: Our proposal is to put a bracketed overhang. One over the main door which is a gable style roof and slightly decorative brackets on the side. The second overhang is to go over our kitchen door, which is our side door. This will have a shed roof with a slightly decorative bracket and this will be different than the front. This is the front door (viewing of the photographs).This is a very complicated house.

Chairman Kelly: Roofing is going to match the existing roof?

Amy Ferguson: Yes.

Chairman Kelly: This projects out approximately 30 inches?

Amy Ferguson: Yes.

Bruce Hartleben: Are you keeping the same glass?

Amy Ferguson: Yes.

Chairman Kelly: Question or concerns from the board?

Bruce Hartleben: No.

Anne Houck: This is very nice not to get rained on as you enter your front door.

Bruce Hartleben: On this one you talked about the kitchen and you talked about removing the lights and replacing it with one center light.

Amy Ferguson: Yes.

Bruce Hartleben: The front I see two lights, are they going to stay or be removed?

Amy Ferguson: The intention is for them to stay. If they do not I will show you this will match the post lights that we have now. (Viewing of lighting cut sheets) That would be what would go in its place should we need to change them out.

Bruce Hartleben: I move that we accept this application as it was presented

Anne Houck: Second

Bruce Hartleben: Aye, on the motion

Anne Houck: Aye, on the second

Patty Kiernan: Aye.

Chairman Kelly: Aye.

4. George Coppola Case #ARB08-13

5 Brentwood Court Alterations/Portico

Mount Kisco, New York 10549

George Coppola, applicant

Daniel Diaz, engineer

Daniel Diaz: I would like to show you some pictures that you may not have of 5 Brentwood. I would also like to show you this picture that was taken by Mr. Coppola. This house is around the corner from Carlton.

George Coppola: There are about a 100 houses with different variations of each other. This is located in Mt. Kisco Chase. In essence all I am trying to do is have the portico in plain view and cover the base which now is too shy.

Daniel Diaz: You can see here the elevation that was presented by Toll Brothers. It is going to be extended approximately 18 inches to cover the entire front stoop.

Chairman Kelly: Basically you are trying to make it architecturally correct.

Anne Houck: Are you moving the railing?

Daniel Diaz: The post and rail will be moved to the outside also. Right now the railings are in front of; instead of going to the post they are going around them. It will be about a foot wider.

George Coppola: If I snapped my fingers and got it done overnight you would not even notice that it was done.

Daniel Diaz: It is silly to have the actual railings in front of this…

Chairman Kelly: They probably found out they could not get a C of O because of the height and platform. Can you walk us through the material?

Daniel Diaz: The materials are going to be matching the existing. It is going to have crown molding; it will be white as it is now. It will be exactly the same. The unfortunate thing is that he will have to tear it down and then replace it. We may be able to save some of it.

Bruce Hartleben: In this photograph it is showing a little bit shorter.

Daniel Diaz; I think that it would look better being a bit shorter.

Chairman Kelly: Right now it is calling out for two foot six.

George Coppola: No we are going to call that out smaller.

Daniel Diaz: Maybe about 20 inches.

Chairman Kelly: This drawing here says 20 inches, but then the detail says 2'.6”.

Daniel Diaz: You are right. It is going to be 20” plus the rail and that would bring it to 24”. If it is ok with the board, when the contractor is setting the rail Mr. Coppola will be at the bottom to make sure it will be a certain length. So it will be 18-20”.

George Coppola: About 6” that what it actually is.

Daniel Diaz: Right now it is a good 24”.

George Coppola: When you look at it now it looks large for the space it is trying to mimic.

Daniel Diaz: If